Thursday, 23 March 2017

Charity Shop Conversations

My charity shop buddy often starts a conversation with "don't you think.." and I have to be honest most of the time I don't think that thing, but we talk about it anyway. 

The conversation could be about anything she'd read in the local paper but yesterday it was about someone bringing up their child as a vegetarian. "But don't you think she should have personal choice, she's only two". So I thought about it, had a sip of the beyond awful instant coffee we have at the moment, and said that I didn't think as a two year old she really had much personal choice about anything, that we're a brought up and live our lives believing and doing all manner of things, none of them are based on facts, they're just based on tradition, convention, belief system, location, money and all manner of other things. Things that seem normal and right to me might seem incredibly odd to someone else - something I learned every day when I went out with a lad from London, he thought I was very strange indeed!

"Well, I grew up on a farm, killing and eating animals was normal" she replied, "you illustrate my point beautifully then" said I. "Oh yes, I see what you mean, shall we have another biscuit, I'll tell you what I think about the nonsense that is so called free-range eggs". Go on then, you've twisted my arm.

20 comments:

  1. A friend of mine's Mum who raised her children veggie said you can't un-eat meat - they can decide if they want to eat animals when they're older and doing their own cooking, but feeding them meat when they're children is taking away that option to have never done it.
    Personally I think if you disagree with something like eating meat, why would you raise your children doing something you thought to be wrong. Our children will be raised vegan and we'll explain to them why.

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    1. That's a really interesting point.

      I tried to broaden out our conversation by making exactly your point, we're all raised with certain belief systems, but often we don't think they're any different to other people, we don't even think about it. It's only when it's something less conventional that other people even notice.

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    2. Exactly, and since having an onmni diet is convention anything but that seems to be considered a bit out there or irresponsible even.
      I didn't even associate meat with animals until I was 9 - I remember walking through the market and seeing the animals hanging up and having a real 'oh no' moment when I really realised what I'd been eating, and went veggie then. I don't think anyone could say I had personal choice about being a meat-eater until then as I was so uninformed..

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    3. My brother became a vegetarian at around the same age and for exactly the same reason as you. He went to the chicken stall with my mum, made the connection and that was that. Shamefully it took me a lot longer than that to make the leap.

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  2. I'll try again!:

    People who say 'wait till they can choose for themselves' usually mean 'bring them up according to MY world view, which is obviously the only correct one'.

    My husband said the same thing to me when I went vegan. I would love our kids to be vegan and will turn them eventually :D. Thankfully I do 90% of the cooking for them.

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    1. Yes, you have a very good point there, the way a person lives makes so much sense to each of us as we do it that it doesn't often occur to us that it could be any other way.

      People say to me all the time that I should put my rabbits outside, I just ask them why and they never know what to say, it's just convention, I think sometimes people say things just for the sake of saying it, there's no argument other than "because it's different (and I don't understand it)".

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  3. If you grow up in a meat eating family - you're given meat, personal choice doesn't come in to it either. My parents were proper carnivores where chicken is considered a vegetable, I can remember when I was 16 and carefully raised the idea of a vegetable pie and my mother's horrified response being ... you are not going to be one of those vegetarians?!?!?' My husband is a part time 'hobbyist' carnivore as is my youngest son, my eldest and I are veggies, all personal choice.

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    1. That's a really good point.

      I have been amazed by my family, even my eldest brother who doesn't really care if people like his views or not. He bought me a tin of jackfruit a little while ago because he thought I'd like it, and when we had a BBQ he ate a bean burger and confessed he does enjoy them every now and again!

      When we go out with my parents Father always has the meat-free option now, something I would never have imagined he would do. He's never said anything but I've noticed he does it.

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  4. I often wonder what filter people look through at life. Feels like a lot of dissonance.
    I have yesterday's London in mind. What possesses a person to do that?
    Persons, thinking of Orlando, Nice, San Bernadino, etc
    John W@yne G@cy, T3d Bundy, J3ffrey D@umer must have been sweet little babies at one time.
    Sorry to be morbid.

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    1. No, not at all. I think I raised the topic yesterday because I was thinking about the different ways people see the world, from something fairly mundane like what we eat to the way we think we can promote change in the world - listening to people talk about Martin McGuinness, for example, and how they may not forgive on a personal level, but could set that aside in favour of something bigger than themselves and help to work towards peace. Then obviously the events in London, how someone reaches that point and our response to it.

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  5. I'm struggling to comment with your new blog layout so I hope this works. I think conversations like this are wonderful. It's how we learn from each other and appreciate (or not) our differences. As long as they don't evolve into an argument. Get yourselves some better coffee though. X

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    1. I know what you mean, I've tried to make the comment area more obvious but I don't have the skills.

      I do enjoy having the opportunity to have a conversation with people that share totally different views to myself, what I've found most often is that people are genuinely surprised that I don't agree! I don't think the conversations change anything, but they can be eye-opening, we had some very interesting chats on the topic of a certain politician last year!

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  6. I get comments all the time. "what, so you only eat, like salad and stuff?" Lol I still eat eggs, I know, I could try harder but eggs are a quick dinner. I have them maybe 2-3 times a week. So I am part time vegan? I dunno! LMAO I try, that is what matters.

    You know, one thing that really influenced me and still does. Avatar the film. I know I am a daft bat really. But when they say how everything is alive and connected. I couldnt then eat meat.

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    1. Avatar has such a strong environmental message that I'm not surprised it helped you to make the connection. If it makes you feel any better I ignored all the facts and animal considerations - I gave up eating meat to save money! We'd been eating organic meat and dairy, choosing to believe it was "better" then we didn't have the money to buy it so we just stopped.

      Dan was the driving force for becoming vegan, I have always struggled with food and so fear held me back. Not anymore!

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  7. Lovely point, we are all different, and I am jolly well pleased we are. I work with a young lady who is vegan, and we have very interesting conversations about our planet and who and what lives here and how we treat each other.

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  8. Hubby and I are carnivores, the boys less so. I would love to try a few more veggie based meals, but don't know how to do so and still get the protein we need. I am cutting down on the meat used to make our meals however, so that is a good thing.

    The way I see it is everybody is different, and being different, accepting the differences is a very good thing. We learn from each other and as long as things stay civil and friendly with no name calling I am happy (had a few bad experiences, but learned from them). Just think how boring the world would be if we were all the same.

    Took me awhile to figure out how to comment a couple of days ago, but now all is good.

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    1. Apologies that it's not as obvious how to comment, as I said earlier, I have tried to alter it but don't have the skills, but I do like the rest of the layout :(

      Reducing meat consumption does take a bit of work, it took a while to get the balance of taste and feeling satisfied after a meal, but I think there's never been a better time to reduce/cut out animal products. Plant based eating is so high profile at the moment and there are so many recipes available using regular foods - other people have done all the hard work for us!

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  9. I was raised as a meat eater and am now a vegan. My parents had very little money but my grandfather was a greengrocer, and my Mum, who is a great cook, cooked a lot of vegetarian meals (very hippyish in the 60s!). I did the same when I was a single mother. Unfortunately, my boys are all meat eaters still, but do cook a lot of vegetarian/vegan meals and I hope that one day they will be fully converted. I do wish I had raised them to be veggies and admire people that do xxx

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    1. Wow. I can imagine it's a totally different world in terms of food choices these days!

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